In episode 144, I’m joined by Ali Mirza, a sales expert who’s personally closed over $450 million in revenue and advised hundreds of high-growth companies, including multiple Inc. 500 winners and successful exits.

Ali and I dig into what’s really broken in agency sales today — from why “more leads” isn’t the answer, to how founders unintentionally sabotage deals, to the mindset shifts required to close larger, more confident engagements. This conversation is especially relevant for agency owners who are great at delivery but feel stuck, uncomfortable, or inconsistent when it comes to selling.

We talk candidly about sales systems vs. sales personalities, the danger of winging it, and how agencies can move from reactive selling to intentional, scalable growth without becoming someone they’re not.

Key Bytes

• Why “just getting more leads” rarely fixes agency sales problems

• The hidden mindset traps that keep agency owners underpricing

• How confidence (not pressure) actually drives better close rates

• The difference between selling expertise vs. selling outcomes

• Why inconsistent sales processes hurt valuation and scalability

Chapters

00:00 Why agency sales feels harder than it should

04:32 The biggest sales myths agency owners believe

09:15 Why confidence matters more than scripts

14:40 Selling outcomes vs. selling services

20:05 How founders accidentally sabotage deals

26:18 Pricing fear and the psychology behind it

32:10 Building a repeatable sales process

38:45 What great agency sales leadership really looks like

44:20 Final advice for agency owners who hate selling

Ali Mirza is a sales expert who has personally closed over $450 million in sales with multiple Inc. 500 companies and high-growth startups.

His work has been featured in Inc., Forbes, Huffington Post, Business Insider, and more. He has consulted for hundreds of companies, with 17 earning the Inc. 500 Fastest Growing Companies award and three successfully acquired. He is president of Atlanta-based consulting firm, Rose Garden.

Connect with Ali:

alimirza.com

rosegardenconsulting.com

IG: @alimirza.rgc

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In episode 143, I dig into one of the most underestimated risks in agency ownership: the legal blind spots that quietly cost agencies millions over time.

From contracts and scope creep to client disputes, IP ownership, and liability exposure, we unpack where agencies unknowingly put themselves at risk — and why most don’t realize it until it’s too late.

This conversation is a must-listen for agency owners who want to protect what they’ve built, reduce unnecessary exposure, and stop treating legal as an afterthought instead of a growth safeguard.

Key Bytes

• Most agencies don’t realize their biggest legal risks until a problem hits

• Poor contracts quietly drain profit long before lawsuits happen

• Scope creep is as much a legal issue as it is a pricing issue

• IP ownership mistakes can create long-term client and valuation problems

• Proactive legal structure is a growth advantage, not a cost center

Chapters

00:00 Why legal blind spots are so common in agencies

04:15 The contracts agencies rely on (and why they fall short)

10:20 Scope creep as a legal and financial issue

18:05 IP ownership mistakes that come back years later

26:40 Client disputes: where agencies expose themselves

34:10 Risk vs. fear: what actually matters legally

42:00 Simple fixes agency owners can make now

50:10 How legal hygiene protects valuation and exit

56:30 Final thoughts & wrap-up

Sharon Toerek is Founder of Toerek Law (doing business in the agency world as Legal + Creative), where she focuses her national law practice on helping advertising, marketing, communications and creative agencies protect their assets and turn their ideas into revenue.

Sharon provides proactive, strategic counsel to communications, marketing, advertising, digital and creative agencies on legal and business issues they face continually in their work, including:

• agency-client relationships, including agency service contracts

• agency-freelancer and agency strategic alliance relationship management

• trademark and copyright protection, enforcement and licensing

• influencer marketing negotiations and content marketing legal compliance

• advertising regulatory compliance

• AI policy and risk management for agencies

Sharon is an approved participant on the 4A's Legal Consultants Panel, and a member of the 4A’s Expert Network. She has also served as President of the American Ad Federation (AAF) Cleveland and has been elected to AAF Cleveland’s Hall of Fame.

In addition to her Firm’s work representing U.S. independent agencies, Sharon

• Created the Legal + Creative Agency Protection System, a comprehensive legal education and legal toolkit for marketing, ad and creative services agencies

• Created and hosted over 300 episodes of the agency-focused podcast The Innovative Agency, a podcast about innovation and trends in the marketing agency world

• Presents sessions on agency-critical legal topics to independent agency networks, to private agency audiences, and at industry conferences including INBOUND, Content Marketing World, MAICON, the Build a Better Agency Summit, Own It Summit, Mirren New York, and PRSA Counselors Academy.

Contact Sharon:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/sharontoerek/

https://legalandcreative.com/

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In episode 142, I sit down with Amy Maxwell, founder and creative director of Maxwell Design, to talk about the real tension small creative shops face: how do you grow without sacrificing the craft that made you successful in the first place?

We dig into what it looks like to evolve from “hands-on designer” to “agency leader,” how to protect quality as you add capacity, and how to make smart choices about clients, process, and scope so growth doesn’t turn into chaos. If you want to scale with intention (and still love the work), this one’s for you.

Key Bytes

• Scaling doesn’t have to mean sacrificing creative quality

• Your process is what protects the craft as you grow

• “Better clients” often solves what “more clients” can’t

• You can stay hands-on without being the bottleneck

• The right constraints create consistency, not limitation

• Hiring should reduce friction, not add management drag

• Clear scope and boundaries prevent quiet burnout

Chapters

00:00 Intro: scaling without losing the craft

02:10 Amy’s origin story and building Maxwell Design

06:20 The “stay small” choice and what it protects

11:05 When growth starts to strain quality (warning signs)

16:10 Processes that keep creative standards high

22:30 Team structure: support roles vs creative roles

28:40 Client fit, boundaries, and saying “no” earlier

34:15 Staying fulfilled while the business grows

40:20 Rapid-fire questions and wrap-up

Amy—Creative Director + Founder of Maxwell Design—has spent the last two decades helping businesses look their best. She’s an award-winning designer with a knack for reading minds and creating delightful visual experiences. Her solution-focused approach makes her someone you’ll want in any room. And her small (but mighty) team comes with some major design chops.

https://www.linkedin.com/in/maxwelldesignco/

http://maxwelldesignco.com/

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In episode 141, I sit down with Melissa and Meredith, the hosts of the Agency Darlings podcast and longtime agency operators, to unpack why so many agency owners feel burned out, stuck, or disillusioned by the traditional agency growth advice that’s been circulating for decades.

We talk candidly about the “bro playbook” — hustle culture, ego-driven leadership, top-down decision making, and growth at all costs — and why it often leads to unhealthy teams, poor margins, and miserable owners. Melissa and Meredith share what they’ve learned from years inside agencies about what actually drives sustainable growth: emotional intelligence, clear communication, strong operations, and leadership that prioritizes people alongside profit.

This episode is a refreshing, grounded look at agency leadership through a more human lens — one that challenges outdated norms and offers agency owners permission to build businesses that align with who they actually are.

Key Bytes

• Why the traditional agency “bro playbook” is failing modern agencies• The hidden cost of hustle culture on owners and teams• How emotional intelligence impacts agency growth and retention• What healthier leadership looks like inside agencies• Redefining success beyond revenue and headcount

Chapters

00:00 Why the traditional agency playbook feels broken05:12 The origins of hustle culture in agencies11:04 Masculine-driven leadership norms and their impact17:32 Emotional intelligence as a growth lever23:58 Building healthier agency cultures30:41 Operator-led leadership vs. ego-led leadership37:10 Sustainable growth without burnout43:26 Redefining success as an agency owner49:12 Advice for owners ready to do things differently

Each with over 15 years of experience in the agency space and deep-rooted connections within the industry, Melissa and Meredith bring actionable insights, expert advice, and candid conversations that challenge the conventional, masculine-driven approaches to agency growth.

Contact Meredith & Melissa:www.agencydarlings.comhttps://bit.ly/MWDarlingshttps://waverlyave.comhttps://instagram.com/waverlyave.cohttps://www.lecheile.co/contacthttps://www.instagram.com/lecheile.co/

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In episode 140, I sit down with Michael Janda—agency founder, bestselling author, and one of the most respected voices helping creatives master the business side of creativity. Michael built and sold Riser, worked with giants like Disney and Google, and later led creative teams at Fox before dedicating his career to teaching creatives how to price, position, and run their businesses without burning out.

We dig into the mental and operational “growing up” that every creative eventually faces: getting past portfolio thinking, charging confidently, understanding value, eliminating chaos, and building a more peaceful (and profitable) creative life. Michael’s straight-talk wisdom hits every agency owner exactly where they need it—no fluff, no ego, just clarity.

Key Bytes

• Why creatives struggle with pricing — and how to fix it

• The mindset shift from freelancer to business owner

• How Michael positioned his agency to win massive clients

• The surprising relationship between process, profit, and peace

• What creatives get wrong about value

• Why “portfolio thinking” holds owners back

• How to build a business that supports your life, not the other way around

Chapters

00:01 Welcome + Michael’s background and agency journey

04:12 From creative chaos to building processes that scale

09:45 Why pricing is emotional—and how to make it objective

14:30 Portfolio vs. business owner mindset

19:58 Finding ideal clients and positioning that works

25:21 How Michael sold his agency and what he learned

31:44 The psychology of creative profitability

38:10 Achieving peace of mind as an owner

44:22 Michael’s advice for creatives who feel “stuck”

Michael Janda is an award-winning creative director, agency founder, and bestselling author.

He built the creative agency Riser with clients like Disney, Google, Warner Bros., and ABC, then sold the business after 13 successful years. Before that, he served as a creative director at Fox. Michael

is the author of Burn Your Portfolio and The Psychology of Graphic Design Pricing. Today, he shares practical, no-fluff strategies to help creative professionals master business, pricing, and growth.

Community: https://morecreativeacademy.com

Instagram: https://instagram.com/morejanda

YouTube: https://youtube.com/morejanda

LinkedIn: https://linkedin.com/in/morejanda

Website: https://michaeljanda.com

Courses: https://morejanda.teachable.com

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Ep 139 – Melanie Chandruang, We Consult – Agency Ops that Actually Scale: Financials, Workflows, and AI That Works

In episode 139, I sit down with Melanie Chandruang, founder of WeConsult and a strategic operations partner for creative agencies. Melanie has spent the last seven years helping agencies tighten up their financials, streamline workflows, and build stronger leadership teams—while also navigating two maternity leaves, a cross-country move, and re-entering the industry in one of its toughest seasons.

We dig into how she rebuilt WeConsult after stepping away to have kids, what’s changed in the agency landscape since 2023, and why she’s now staying higher-level as a fractional ops leader instead of getting buried in implementation. Melanie breaks down what healthy leadership actually looks like, why so many founders remain the bottleneck even after hiring “senior” people, and how clear ownership, scorecards, and trust change everything.

We also get tactical: what she looks for first in the financials, the operational metrics that matter most, and why agencies without documented processes are struggling the most with AI adoption. We wrap by talking about leading through uncertainty, avoiding burnout, and the simple practice Melanie uses to remind herself of the value she’s creating—plus her very 90s go-to karaoke song.

Key Bytes
• Clean financials and clear reporting are the true foundation of scalable ops

• Workflow ownership matters — if it’s nobody’s job, it’s nobody’s job

• Founders stay bottlenecks when leadership has no autonomy or scorecards

• Agencies with documented systems adopt AI faster (and with fewer messes)

• Strong leadership = trust, clarity, and shared problem-solving

• Self-care and boundaries are essential for sustainable agency ownership

Chapters

00:01 Intro and how Melanie rebuilt WeConsult after kids and a cross-country move

02:48 Stepping away from client work, losing momentum, and clawing back into a changed industry

05:36 Why Melanie now stays high-level and pushes implementation to internal teams and automation

07:42 Founders as bottlenecks and what a truly strong leadership team looks like

11:15 Ego, scale, and the operational shifts required for owners to get out of the way

15:36 Where Melanie starts operationally: financials, workflows, and clear ownership

18:07 The agency financial metrics that actually matter (profitability, cash, utilization, and more)

22:03 Why documented systems are the key to successful AI adoption (and how messy it gets without them)

26:00 Leading through uncertainty, rebuilding a business, and protecting your own wellbeing

28:38 AI note-takers, imposter syndrome, and Melanie’s “value” practice

31:36 Melanie’s 90s karaoke pick and where to learn more about WeConsult

Melanie Chandruang is the Founder of WeConsult and a Strategic Operations Partner for creative agencies. With over 15 years in the industry, she helps agency owners boost profits, streamline operations, and move big initiatives forward so they can focus on growth and what matters most.

https://weconsult.io/

Ep 138 – Jordan Snider, Token Creative – The impact of integrating Ignition App

In episode 138, I sit down with Jordan Snider, co-founder and CTO of Token Creative Services, to break down the real impact of integrating Ignition App into their agency operations. Jordan shares how Token went from scattered proposals, manual invoices, and nearly $40k in aging AR to a streamlined, single-system workflow that clients actually appreciated.

We dig into the operational before/after: centralized proposals and agreements, automated billing, faster close rates, clearer scope definition, easier upsells and renewals, and the elimination of unbilled “mystery hours.” Jordan also talks about forecasting clarity — and why dashboards that tie proposals, renewals, and revenue projections together are a game changer for decision-making.

This episode is a grounded look at what happens when an agency stops tolerating a duct-taped sales and billing process and finally upgrades the operational spine of the business.

Key Bytes

• Token’s breaking point was nearly $40k in aging AR — a clear sign the proposal and billing process was broken.

• Clients were confused by multiple proposal versions, scattered contracts, and manual payments; consolidating everything through Ignition simplified the entire client experience.

• The biggest financial lift came from capturing previously unbilled variable hours and out-of-scope work.

• Automated reminders and stored payment methods dramatically reduced AR and manual follow-up.

• Forecasting became easier with visible open proposals, renewal pipelines, and year-over-year revenue projections.

• Simplifying the tech stack cut both software cost and constant integration maintenance.

• Ignition enabled Token to shift from hourly pricing to value-driven retainers because operations finally supported it.

• Jordan’s advice: delaying this overhaul guarantees regret — proactively fixing it avoids the forced crisis moment.

Chapters

00:00 Intro and why Token’s Ignition story matters

02:05 Token’s early days and “brute force” agency ops

03:10 The $40k AR wake-up call

05:10 What was broken in their proposal + onboarding workflow

06:55 Client reactions after switching to Ignition

07:50 Close rates, renewals, and handling scope creep

09:40 Capturing unbilled work and shrinking AR

11:55 Forecasting and metrics that changed decision-making

14:00 Simplifying the tech stack and ditching integrations

16:40 How clarity improved both scope and service delivery

23:40 Productizing services and shifting to retainers

25:05 Jordan’s advice for agencies resisting the overhaul

26:50 Rapid fire and wrap-up

Jordan Snider is the Co-Founder and CTOof Token Creative Services, a full-service digital marketing and creative agency based in Kitchener-Waterloo. With a background in full-stack software engineering, Jordan bridges the gap between technical development and creative marketing. He has contributed personal reflections to platforms supporting victims of family violence, discussing the unique stressors faced by newcomers and the importance of community support systems.

His work reflects a blend of technical precision and a commitment to social impact, aligning with Token Creative’s mission to support businesses making positive environmental or social changes.

token.ca

ignitionapp.info/agencybytes-trial

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Ep 137 – Jennifer Spire, Preston Spire – Built to Last: The 75-Year Agency Still Breaking Rules

In episode 137, I sit down with Jennifer Spire, Partner and CEO of Preston Spire — a 75-year-old agency that’s somehow still pushing boundaries while many newer shops flame out. Jennifer shares how she modernized a legacy company without losing the cultural DNA that kept it alive for three-quarters of a century. We get into leadership transitions, building a values-driven agency, navigating generational shifts in talent, and how she’s shaping the next era of a Midwest powerhouse.

Key Bytes

• The hidden advantages legacy agencies have but often ignore

• Why values act as a competitive moat — but only if they’re enforced

• How Jennifer leads change without blowing up culture

• The reality of modernizing 75-year-old processes

• Where agencies underestimate the work of staying relevant

Chapters

00:00 Intro

01:20 What it means to run a 75-year-old agency today

05:05 How Jennifer modernized Preston Spier without breaking it

09:40 The cultural DNA that actually drives retention

13:55 Why “values” only matter when leaders enforce them

17:48 Leadership evolution: from partner to CEO

21:30 What younger talent expects from an established shop

25:18 Staying relevant in a fast-changing industry

29:55 How Preston Spire balances legacy and innovation

33:42 Advice Jennifer wishes she had earlier

38:10 Closing thoughts

Jennifer Spire is partner and CEO at Preston Spire, an Ad Age Best Place to Work and Midwest Small Agency of the Year. She is an accomplished agency leader with over 25 years of experience in both consumer and B2B marketing for just about every industry out there. At Preston Spire, Jennifer has played the leading role in reshaping the framework that defines the agency, focused on a strong vision, values and purpose. She has been a speaker at dozens of local and national conferences, has authored articles and thought pieces on various marketing subjects, and has been a board member of several nonprofit organizations. Jennifer was an east coast native before calling Minneapolis home. She was an NCGA gymnast and a gymnastics coach, who also had advertising in her blood, thanks to her grandfather being one of the founding fathers of Madison Avenue.

Contact Jennifer:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/jennifer-spire-a992462/

https://www.prestonspire.com/

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Ep 136 – JP Holecka, Power Shifter Digital – Building the AI-Driven Agency: Lessons from Power Shifter’s Evolution

In episode 136, I sit down with JP Holecka, founder and CEO of Power Shifter Digital, a Vancouver-based agency leading the shift toward AI-driven digital products and content creation. With over 30 years of experience in design, film, and technology, JP has guided multiple teams through successful AI rollouts—transforming workflows, scaling creativity, and redefining how digital agencies deliver value.

We talk about what it really takes to evolve your agency for the AI era, how to navigate the culture shift that comes with automation, and why embracing AI is less about replacing people and more about amplifying what they’re capable of.

KEY BYTES

• AI isn’t replacing creativity—it’s amplifying it

• True transformation starts with changing workflows, not job titles

• The most successful AI rollouts start with internal adoption before client delivery

• Leadership has to model curiosity and experimentation

• Agencies that treat AI as a tool, not a threat, are finding their competitive edge

CHAPTERS

00:00 Introduction

02:01 JP’s background and the evolution of Power Shifter

06:32 The first AI experiments that changed everything

10:45 Getting team buy-in and overcoming initial skepticism

14:58 Building processes around AI rather than forcing it in

20:10 Human creativity in the age of automation

25:36 How AI has changed client expectations

31:12 Leadership lessons from scaling an AI-driven agency

36:45 The next frontier of digital work

40:30 JP’s advice for agency founders starting their AI journey

43:00 Rapid Fire Questions

JP Holecka is the founder and CEO of Power Shifter Digital, a Vancouver-based agency leading the shift toward AI-driven digital products and content creation. With over 30 years of experience in design, film, and technology, JP has guided multiple agencies through successful AI rollouts—transforming workflows, scaling creativity, and redefining how teams collaborate with generative tools.

https://www.powershifter.com/studio

https://www.linkedin.com/in/jpholecka/

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In episode 135, I sit down with Drew McLellan, CEO of Agency Management Institute and host of the Build a Better Agency podcast. Drew’s been in the business for over 30 years and has coached thousands of agencies on how to grow profitably, attract better clients, and actually enjoy the perks of ownership.

In this conversation, we unpack what the real job of an agency owner is — and how easy it is to get lost in the weeds doing everyone else’s. Drew shares how founders can move from day-to-day chaos to the higher-level work of vision, leadership, and building a pipeline that doesn’t depend on them. We also talk about the mental shift from “founder hustle” to “CEO clarity,” and what it really means to build an agency that serves your life, not the other way around.

Key Bytes

• The three things only the owner can and should do

• Why your agency’s profit tells the truth about your leadership

• Building a self-sustaining pipeline that runs without you

• How to structure your week around the owner’s actual job

• The difference between running an agency and owning a business

• What makes an agency truly “sellable”

• Common traps that keep founders stuck in the weeds

• How to get your time back without losing control

Chapters

00:00 Welcome and Drew’s background

04:12 The evolution from founder to true agency owner

09:45 What the “owner’s actual job” really is

14:58 Why agency profit is a mirror of leadership

20:17 Building systems and pipelines that aren’t you

26:04 The importance of clarity and delegation

31:42 Common mistakes that limit scalability

38:27 How to build an agency that can thrive without you

44:10 Preparing for eventual sale or succession

49:22 Drew’s advice for new and seasoned agency owners

Drew McLellan has worked in advertising for 30+ years and started his own agency, McLellan Marketing Group in 1995 after a five-year stint at Y&R and still actively runs the agency.

He spends the lion’s share of his time running Agency Management Institute (AMI), which he also co-owns/runs with his wife Danyel.

AMI serves thousands of agencies small to mid-sized agencies (advertising, digital, marketing, media and PR) every year, so they can increase their AGI, attract better clients and employees, mitigate the risks of being self-employed in a such volatile business and best of all — let the agency owner actually enjoy the perks of agency ownership.

AMI is the only agency network that is run by an active agency owner. It offers:

Public workshops for agency owners, leaders and account service staff

Owner peer networks (like a Vistage group or 4A’s forums)

Private coaching/consulting for agency owners

Annual primary research with CMOs and client decision makers about their work with agencies

The highly praised podcast Build A Better Agency

The only conference built for small to mid-sized agencies – the Build A Better Agency Summit

Drew often appears in publications like Entrepreneur Magazine, New York Times, Washington Post, Forbes, AdAge, CNN, BusinessWeek, and many others. The Wall Street Journal calls him “one of 10 bloggers every entrepreneur should read.”

He’s also written several books, the most recent being Sell with Authority (January 2020). The latest book has garnered rave reviews and has been the guidebook for agency growth and business development in today’s world.

Drew also speaks at leading agency and marketing conferences like Inbound, Content Marketing World and MAICON and is often cited in agency centric content for his expertise in the industry.

When he’s not hanging out with clients or agency owners and their staff, Drew spends time with his wife, their blended family and following his beloved Dodgers.

http://agencymanagementinstitute.com

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In episode 134, I sit down with Jen Moss, Chief Creative Officer and co-founder of JAR, where she helps brands and agencies craft podcasts that move people—not just metrics.

Jen calls herself a podcasting doula, guiding clients through the messy middle of creative storytelling. In this conversation, we dive into how to create audio that actually connects, what makes a podcast worth listening to, and why “Job, Audience, Result” is the framework every agency should adopt before hitting record.

Jen and I explore why most branded podcasts fizzle, how to define success beyond downloads, and the difference between authenticity and algorithm-chasing. If you’ve ever thought about starting a podcast for your agency—or making your current one work harder—this episode’s for you.

Key Bytes

• The JAR method: Job, Audience, Result—a simple framework for podcast strategy.

• Why authenticity and storytelling beat reach every time.

• How agencies can use podcasts as pillar content that drives real relationships.

• Common landmines when launching an agency podcast.

• Why generosity and curiosity build audience trust.

• The most meaningful metrics: engagement, consumption rate, and return listeners.

• When to use internal vs. external hosts—and why it depends.

• The role of creative courage in a crowded podcast space.

• Why “connection” should always be your North Star.

Chapters

00:00 Intro – Meet Jen Moss, podcasting doula and CCO of JAR

02:00 From theater to radio: Jen’s storytelling roots

06:00 The JAR framework explained: Job, Audience, Result

09:30 The real “why” behind launching a podcast

12:30 How agencies can use podcasts as strategic marketing tools

16:30 Internal vs. external hosts: what actually works

19:45 Common landmines and why most podcasts fizzle

22:00 Authenticity, generosity, and giving value away

24:30 Is podcasting too saturated? Finding signal in the noise

27:45 Connection over clicks—how to stand out

31:00 The metrics that matter: consumption, return, and reach trends

33:50 Rapid Fire with Jen Moss: storytelling, creative courage, and dream guests

In her role as Chief Creative Officer of JAR, Co-Founder Jen Moss loves bringing stories to life. With her clients, Jen acts as a “podcasting Doula,” helping them harness their strengths in service of great storytelling. Deeply steeped in the creative process, Jen is unafraid of its ambiguities, and enjoys guiding others through its twists and turns. Drawing on her strong background in theatre, arts journalism, audio documentary, and new media storytelling, Jen helps clients tell the authentic stories that matter to them, and to their audience. She spent many years working as a producer and award-winning content creator for CBC Radio, and as an interactive story producer for The National Film Board of Canada’s Digital Studio, which taught her to think of stories as living things, full of potential for impact. It also taught her to take an “audience first” approach. Jen is never afraid of surfacing big ideas, but understands that sometimes, it’s the little things – the specific lens that “only you” can bring – that will gain the most traction with an audience. Jen loves to look for “fresh tracks” in the form of stories that haven’t been told before. She encourages her clients and her team at JAR to try out new ideas, learn from what the audience data reveals, and let that inform future creative strategy. Finally, Jen keeps her own professional learning curve alive as she lectures part-time at the University of British Columbia’s School of Creative Writing, interacting with the next generation of writers, podcasters, new media producers, and audiences.

https://jarpodcasts.com/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/jennifer-moss-8a356930/

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In episode 132, I talk with Leah Leaves, founder of Alderaan Operations Solutions, where she helps remote digital agencies grow without the grind. Known for her no-fluff, systems-first approach, Leah and her team embed expert operations managers directly into agencies to break bottlenecks, reduce burnout, and build businesses that can scale without the founder in every decision.

We dig into what causes owners to become the bottleneck, the difference between goals, systems, and team accountability, and how every agency—no matter the size—can start building a foundation that prevents burnout and supports growth. Leah also shares how to identify when it’s time to bring in an operator, how to delegate effectively, and why even the best creative agencies need structure to thrive. We wrap by exploring how AI fits into internal operations and why every agency needs an AI Ops roadmap, even if it’s just six months ahead.

Key Bytes

• Burnout often begins with unclear goals and missing systems; clarity is the antidote.

• Leah outlines four agency owner archetypes—the Trusting Optimist, Firefighting Founder, Reluctant Gatekeeper, and Visionary Leader—and how operators help each evolve.

• Delegation isn’t dumping tasks; it’s empowering your team with context and ownership.

• Documenting the “why” behind your systems drives consistency and accountability.

• Operators create the scaffolding for scale—allowing founders to focus on vision, not firefighting.

• Every agency, regardless of size, benefits from an AI Ops roadmap to guide internal efficiency.

• Start with what you already have—processes, checklists, or recurring workflows—and build from there.

• Systems don’t kill creativity; they protect it by removing chaos and decision fatigue.

Chapters

00:00 Intro and welcome with guest Leah Leaves, founder of Alderaan Operations Solutions

02:00 The Star Wars origin of “Alderaan” and Leah’s path from journalism to operations

05:30 From creative to systems thinker: finding flow in operations

08:00 How unclear goals and missing systems cause bottlenecks

10:00 Guardrails vs. micromanagement: empowering the team without overengineering

13:00 The burnout cycle and why delegation is a creative act

15:00 The four types of agency owners and their operational challenges

20:00 Shifting from bottleneck to visionary: the operator’s role in scaling

23:30 Why every agency needs an AI ops roadmap

26:30 Putting “robots” in the org chart and making automation work

29:00 Low-hanging AI wins: onboarding, recruiting, and workflow automation

32:00 Rapid-fire Q&A: distilling systems, theme songs, and unexpected client wins

34:45 Closing thoughts and where to find Leah

Leah Leaves is the Founder of Alderaan Operations Solutions, where she helps remote digital marketing agencies grow without the grind. Known for her no-fluff, systems-first approach, she and her team embed expert Operations Managers directly into agencies to break bottlenecks, reduce burnout, and build businesses that can scale without the founder in every decision.

https://www.linkedin.com/in/1eah1eaves/

https://alderaanenterprise.com/

http://agencyownerquiz.com/

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In episode 124, I sit down with Joe Rojas, founder of Start Grow Manage and author of How Entrepreneurs Thrive. Joe has built and sold multiple MSPs, each time leveraging the power of deep niching to accelerate growth. We talk about the pivotal inflection points in a business’s lifecycle, why niching works across any industry, and how systems and values create businesses that can run—and grow—without the owner. Joe shares his framework for moving from “job” to “business,” the core values that drive his work, and how agencies can increase profitability by solving real business problems for clients. We also discuss the parallels between MSPs and agencies when it comes to client retention, lifetime value, and building a life you actually want to live.

Key Bytes

• Niching accelerates growth because it clarifies your offer and your audience

• The difference between a lifestyle job and a lifestyle business is scale and delegation

• Core values must be discovered, not invented—and hiring should be based on them

• Profitability can start with your existing clients, not just new ones

• Long-term success comes from solving clients’ business problems, not just delivering services

Chapters

00:00 Welcome and guest intro

01:06 Joe’s journey from the Army to building and selling MSPs

03:18 Understanding the “Start, Grow, Manage” stages

05:03 Why Joe wrote How Entrepreneurs Thrive

06:33 The $1M inflection point and profitability mindset

08:16 Helping clients reclaim their time and freedom

12:20 Building core values that drive the business

16:46 Hiring for abundance mindset and cultural fit

21:07 How Joe’s book applies to agencies today

24:07 Why technology changes but strategy doesn’t

26:08 Expanding accounts by solving deeper problems

28:37 Mapping the client journey for better results

30:21 Rapid fire questions and closing thoughts

Joe is the Founder at Start Grow Manage, based in New York, and author of How Entrepreneurs Thrive. He empowers Managed Service Providers and entrepreneurs to overcome the challenges of business formation to create profitable, growing businesses. As a serial entrepreneur himself, he has faced the challenge of making new and growing businesses work. His career started in the military, where he became an expert in information technology, eventually forming his own managed services company. Through that experience, he discovered the formula for businesses and learned that entrepreneurs are good at what they do but struggle to build a business.

https://startgrowmanage.com

In episode 123, I sit down with Jenny Plant, founder of Account Management Skills, to talk about why strong account management is the secret weapon for agency growth. Drawing on over 25 years of experience on both the agency and client side, Jenny shares how she helps account managers develop the skills, confidence, and mindset to grow accounts without feeling “salesy.” We discuss the challenges of hybrid AM/PM roles, how to spot rising account management stars, and why curiosity and relationship skills often outweigh industry knowledge. Jenny also dives into her “Four P’s” of AI for account managers—Productivity, Personalization, Prescribe, and Predict—showing how technology can boost proactivity and client value. We wrap with insights on setting growth targets, charging for account management, and building a culture that celebrates account wins as much as new business.

Key Bytes

• Account growth starts with training AMs to be proactive, not just reactive service providers

• Hybrid AM/PM roles often fail to drive growth because delivery takes priority over development

• Curiosity and relationship skills can be more valuable than industry expertise

• AI can help AMs be more productive, personalize interactions, prescribe solutions, and predict client needs

• Co-creating growth targets with AMs boosts buy-in and accuracy

• Celebrating account growth fosters a culture where client retention and expansion matter as much as net new business

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to Jenny Plant & Account Management Skills

02:20 Why sales training is vital for account managers

04:16 The challenge of hybrid AM/PM roles in driving growth

08:58 Traits of successful account managers

11:32 Hiring AMs from outside the agency world

13:14 Jenny’s Four P’s of AI for account managers

18:19 Proactivity and presenting ideas to clients

20:38 Co-creating account growth targets

22:55 Charging for account management services

24:36 How many accounts can one AM manage effectively?

28:15 Creating a culture that celebrates account growth

Jenny Plant is the founder of Account Management Skills a training company helping agency account managers retain client relationships and grow accounts.

Jenny has over 25 years in agency account management and has also worked client-side in marketing for an international airline and pharmaceutical company.

Her account management training programmes blend proven client growth methodologies with the integration of AI tools, helping agencies stay relevant, efficient, and proactive.

She also hosts the Creative Agency Account Manager Podcast, where she shares insights and interviews to elevate the agency-client relationship management standards across the industry.

https://accountmanagementskills.com/

Ep 122 – Arielle Cohen, Business 411 – Building Scalable Systems for a Multi-Seven Figure Agency

In episode 122, I sit down with Ariel Cohn, founder of Marketing 411 and CMO of Business 401, to talk about how she scaled a multi–seven figure agency by going all-in on the roofing niche. Ariel shares why niching transformed their operations, how they built scalable systems and sister companies to serve the industry, and why embracing AI and virtual teams has been key to their growth. We also dive into the mindset shifts required to build an agency that supports your lifestyle — instead of running you into the ground.

Key Bytes

• Niching down creates clarity, repeatable systems, and faster scaling opportunities

• A sister company approach can build trust and open new revenue streams

• Retainer-based models help stabilize cash flow and increase profitability

• Virtual teams and offshore talent can boost efficiency without sacrificing quality

• Embracing AI is no longer optional — it’s essential for agency survival and growth

Chapters

00:01 Intro and Ariel’s background in roofing marketing

01:12 From generalist to roofing specialist: why niching was key

04:44 Myths about niching and lessons from going all-in

07:32 Defining the ideal client profile and setting minimums

09:00 Early challenges and focusing on revenue first

12:34 Building two complementary companies for growth

16:22 Leveraging virtual teams, overseas talent, and AI for scale

19:07 Retainer models vs. one-off projects for stable growth

20:29 Staying hungry and setting bigger goals

23:18 Embracing AI and adapting to industry change

25:10 Rapid fire: worst advice, daily habits, and explaining her job to a 5-year-old

Arielle Cohen is the Co-Founder of Marketing 411 and CMO of Business 411. With over a decade of experience in marketing, she has mastered the art of growing a Multi 7 Figure Agency through building a scalable and efficient operation. As the company grows, her focus has shifted to optimizing her time and building a dream company that supports her vision and lifestyle—without letting the business take over.

www.marketing411.com

www.business411.com

Social: @arielleCEO

Ep 121 – Shawn Johnston, Forge and Smith – Profitable by Design: Streamlining Dev Without Cutting Corners

In episode 121, I sit down with Shawn Johnston, founder of Forge and Smith and creator of Refoundry—a low-code WordPress platform that’s transforming how agencies build and deliver websites. We talk about how Shawn cut delivery time by 70%, turned profit margins around using the Profit First method, and transitioned his agency toward a scalable, productized model. He shares insights on navigating developer pushback, balancing client empowerment with agency control, and preparing for evolving tech shifts like AI in web development. Whether you’re struggling with project bottlenecks, shrinking budgets, or scaling challenges, Shawn’s story offers a clear path forward for building smarter, more profitable systems.

Key Bytes• Refoundry cut Forge and Smith’s development time by 70%, transforming profitability.

• Adopting Profit First changed their approach to pricing and overhead limits.

• Client empowerment through low-code builds loyalty and drives referrals.

• Transitioning leadership allowed Shawn’s team to grow into bigger roles.

• Technological shifts (like Webflow and AI) demand constant agency adaptation.

• Productizing an internal tool opened new revenue streams beyond services.

• Balancing developer pride with client needs is critical for successful adoption.

• Early lessons in print taught Shawn to anticipate and embrace industry change.

Chapters00:01 Introduction to Shawn Johnston and Forge and Smith

02:11 Moving from freelance to full agency and early challenges

04:39 Implementing Profit First and shifting to scalable systems

06:38 Why Refoundry: Bringing low-code to WordPress

08:22 Cutting development time and improving project profitability

11:23 Developer pushback and prioritizing client empowerment

14:44 Evolving Refoundry into a product for other agencies

17:03 Transitioning leadership and building team collaboration

24:17 Preparing for tech shifts like AI and staying nimble in delivery

28:30 Rapid fire questions and final reflections

​​

Shawn Johnston is the founder of Forge and Smith, a digital agency that’s launched over 500 websites in the past 13 years. After hitting the usual delivery bottlenecks and burnout cycles, he built Refoundry—a low-code platform for WordPress that helped his team cut build times by 70% and scale without sacrificing quality. Now he’s on a mission to help other agencies streamline delivery, boost margins, and build systems that actually work.

Contact Shawn:

https://refoundry.io

https://forgeandsmith.com

In episode 115, I sit down with Jason Hennessey, internationally recognized SEO expert and CEO of Hennessey Digital. Jason shares the story of how a single talk at a legal mastermind sparked his first agency, and how he’s since scaled a powerhouse SEO firm serving top-tier law firms. We talk about niching down, the power of building a personal brand, and why delegation was key to scaling without burning out. Jason opens up about leadership, team culture, and how stepping back actually helped his agency grow faster. Plus, we dive into strategies like direct mail, personal outreach, and even outsourcing genius to level up results.

Key Bytes

• Jason Hennessy has been in SEO since 2001 and started his first agency in 2008.

• He transitioned from his first agency to Hennessy Digital in 2015, focusing on law firms.

• Innovative marketing strategies, like sending personalized books, helped him secure clients.

• Hennessy Digital primarily serves personal injury lawyers but sees potential in other legal niches.

• Building a personal brand has significantly increased response rates to his outreach.

• Delegation and outsourcing are key to scaling an agency effectively.

• Jason emphasizes the importance of investing in leadership and team development.

• He still engages with SEO on a personal level, leveraging external expertise.

• Agency culture is a priority, fostering support and recognition among team members.

• Asking for help and seeking coaching is crucial for agency owners.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to Agency Bites and Guest Background

01:04 Jason Hennessy's Journey in SEO and Agency Growth

03:55 Transitioning from First Agency to Hennessy Digital

07:00 Innovative Marketing Strategies for Law Firms

10:06 Market Potential and Niche Focus in Legal SEO

11:58 Building a Personal Brand and Leadership Structure

16:01 Scaling the Agency and Delegating Responsibilities

20:03 Passion for SEO and Outsourcing Expertise

23:05 Expanding Services Beyond SEO

24:54 Agency Culture and Team Dynamics

27:04 Personal Insights and Advice for Agency Owners

Jason Hennessey is an entrepreneur, internationally recognized SEO expert, author, speaker, podcast host, and business coach. Since 2001, Jason has been reverse-engineering the Google algorithm as a self-taught student and practitioner of SEO and search marketing.

Jason's expertise has fueled the growth and successful sale of multiple businesses, starting with a pioneering dot-com venture in the wedding industry. Serving as the CEO of Hennessey Digital since 2015, Jason's leadership has transformed a modest consultancy into a thriving eight-figure agency, earning a place on the prestigious Inc. 5000 list for five consecutive years. He is also the author of two Amazon bestsellers titled Law Firm SEO and Honest SEO.

As a sought-after keynote speaker and a frequent guest on podcasts and webinars, Jason shares his wealth of knowledge. He contributes as a columnist to respected publications such as the Washington Post and is a regular contributor to Entrepreneur, Forbes, Inc., Newsweek, and Rolling Stone Magazine. Jason's accomplishments extend to being honored with the Gold TITAN Business Award in the Entrepreneurship, Branding, Advertising, & Marketing category, as well as being recognized as a National Law Review Go-To Thought Leader.

Jason's journey has been enriched by his experience as a United States Air Force veteran and his attainment of a Bachelor of Arts degree in Marketing from the University of Nevada, Las Vegas. Commencing his SEO career in Las Vegas and later establishing a strong presence in the legal industry in Atlanta, Jason now resides in the Los Angeles area with his wife, Bridget, and their three children.

jasonhennessey.com

hennessey.com

https://www.instagram.com/jasonhennessey/?hl=en

In episode 111 of Agency Bytes, I sit down with Corey Quinn—agency growth expert, author of Anyone, Not Everyone, and the guy who helped scale Scorpion from $20M to $150M. We unpack what it really means to specialize as an agency and why empathy might just be your most overlooked growth lever.

Corey shares how moving from generalist to deep specialization can unlock operational efficiency, stronger positioning, and a hell of a lot more revenue. We also dig into outbound sales strategies (including the power of gifting!), how to expand into multiple verticals without becoming a generalist again, and what the future of agency specialization looks like in an AI-driven world.

If you’ve ever worried about niching down “too far,” this conversation will flip that fear on its head.

Key Bytes

• Corey Quinn emphasizes the importance of deep specialization for agency growth.

• Empathy is crucial for understanding clients' specific problems.

• Transitioning from inbound to outbound sales requires a strategic approach.

• The generalist trap can lead to operational inefficiencies and client loss.

• Building trust through industry engagement is key to agency success.

• Agencies should consider adjacent verticals for expansion.

• Creative teams may need variety to stay engaged in specialized markets.

• The tools used in marketing may change, but the outcomes remain constant.

• Agencies should focus on solving real-world business problems for clients.

• Founders can explore new verticals once they achieve a certain market share.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to Agency Growth and Specialization

01:11 Corey's Journey in the Agency World

03:02 Scaling Scorpion: From 20M to 150M

07:15 The Shift to Outbound Sales Strategies

11:44 Deep Specialization: Breaking the Generalist Trap

12:10 Empathy in Agency Specialization

19:10 Building Trust Through Industry Engagement

21:10 Expanding into New Verticals

25:17 Addressing Fears of Niching Down

27:42 Future Trends in Agency Specialization

Corey Quinn has over 18 years in the agency space, including as Scorpion's CMO, where he helped grow revenue from $20M to $150M in 6 years. His bestselling book: "Anyone, Not Everyone: a Proven System for Agencies to Escape Founder-Led Sales" has been endorsed by Aaron Ross, John Ruhlin, Dr. Benjamin Hardy, Marcel Petitpas, and many others.

Today, his company helps digital agencies become the go-to choice within a vertical market with his Deep Specialization Methodology.

Contact Corey:

https://www.coreyquinn.com

https://www.linkedin.com/in/coreyquinn/

In episode 110 of Agency Bites, I sit down with the incredibly talented James Barnard, a logo designer and design educator based in Australia. We dive deep into his fascinating journey from the publishing world in the UK to building a thriving freelance design business powered by social media — especially TikTok! James shares how he crafted his pricing strategies, attracts qualified leads, and balances freelance life with family life. We also get into his design process, the value of design education today, and how he's expanded his income streams through courses and brand partnerships. Plus, we wrap things up with a few rapid-fire questions that give a glimpse into James's personal side. You won't want to miss this one!

Key Bytes

• James transitioned to graphic design at 25 after a career in publishing.

• Social media, especially TikTok, played a crucial role in his business growth.

• Viral content can significantly increase client leads and visibility.

• Pricing strategies are essential for attracting qualified leads.

• Balancing freelance work with personal life is a priority for James.

• A structured design process leads to higher quality work and client satisfaction.

• Diversifying income streams can alleviate pressure from client work.

• Education in design is evolving with social media as a learning tool.

• James emphasizes the importance of being hands-on in his work.

• Pitching for work is often a waste of time in the design industry. 

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to James Barnard

02:28 James's Journey into Graphic Design

05:30 The Impact of Social Media on Business

09:52 Going Viral: The TikTok Breakthrough

12:27 Pricing Strategies and Qualified Leads

14:49 Balancing Freelance Work and Personal Life

18:57 Design Process and Client Interaction

25:58 Diversifying Income Streams

30:11 The Value of Design Education

31:37 Rapid Fire Questions and Closing Thoughts

James Barnard is a logo designer and design educator specializing in creating logos and visual identities with meaning. With over 15 years of experience in the graphic design industry, he began his career in the UK’s publishing sector before transitioning into branding and education.

Passionate about sharing his expertise, James is dedicated to mentoring and inspiring the next generation of designers through his social platforms, where he provides valuable insights, tutorials, and industry knowledge.

https://barnard.co/

https://instagram.com/barnardco/

https://www.tiktok.com/@barnardco

https://www.youtube.com/@barnardco

https://www.linkedin.com/in/jamesrbarnard/

In episode 109 of Agency Bytes, I sit down with Tony Wilson, founder of Accquip and a financial powerhouse for agencies who want to stop flying blind. Tony shares his story of stepping out of corporate during the Great Resignation and stepping into his passion—helping agency owners build profitable businesses they actually love running.

We break down Days Till Zero, a simple but powerful metric Tony developed to help agency owners understand exactly how long their cash will last—and how to make smarter, proactive decisions before things get tight. Tony also dives into gross margin benchmarks, how overlooked they are, and why net profit alone doesn’t tell the full story.

Plus, we talk through:

•  Red light, yellow light, and green light cash benchmarks every owner should know

•  Project-level gross margin mistakes (and how to fix them)

•  Why time tracking is about clarity, not micromanagement

•  Smart investments vs. sitting on cash

If you’re ready to stop reacting and start running your agency with financial confidence, this one’s for you.

Key Bytes

• Tony Wilson's journey reflects the empowerment of agency owners.

• Accquip focuses on educating entrepreneurs about accounting.

• Understanding financial metrics leads to better decision-making.

• Days till zero is a crucial metric for agency health.

• Proactive financial management can prevent crises.

• Cash reserves should be monitored regularly.

• Gross margins are vital for assessing agency profitability.

• Identifying project profitability helps in resource allocation.

• Time tracking provides valuable operational insights.

• Agencies should prioritize selling over playing business.

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to Agency Bites and Tony Wilson's Journey

01:37 The Concept of Equip and Its Mission

03:46 Understanding Days Till Zero: A Key Metric for Agencies

08:54 Proactive Financial Management for Agencies

11:34 Cash Reserves: Understanding Red, Yellow, and Green Light Zones

14:39 The Importance of Gross Margins in Agency Profitability

18:21 Identifying and Addressing Overhead and Project Profitability

21:02 Tools and Systems for Effective Time Tracking and Financial Management

24:11 Rapid Fire Questions and Closing Thoughts

Tony Wilson’s entrepreneurial journey was shaped by three pivotal moments: launching a business with his brother in 2010, witnessing his roommate’s life-changing pivot from carpenter to software developer, and becoming a father—which ignited his drive to lead by example. In 2021, Tony joined “The Great Resignation” to help digital agency owners grow thriving, profitable businesses without sacrificing their well-being. Through Accquip, he is on a mission to empower agency owners to build the businesses they love without going bankrupt in the process.

Contact Tony:

www.accquip.com

https://www.linkedin.com/in/tony-wilson-cpa/